Simon Phillips performing in the United Kingdom, 2014. Photo by Richard Ecclestone/Redferns
The progressive rock quintet DarWin is comprised of DarWin on rhythm guitar, Simon Phillips on drums, along with production duties, and Matt Bissonette on vocals, with all three as the principal songwriters. They are joined by lead guitarist Greg Howe and bassist Mohini Dey, along with some guests. Phillips was a member of Toto from 1992 through 2014. He spoke with Goldmine about a pair of Toto songs plus many of the songs from the new DarWin album.
L-R: Matt Bissonette, Simon Phillips, Greg Howe, DarWin, and Mohini Dey, photo courtesy of DarWin
GOLDMINE:Welcome to Goldmine. Let’s go back to your many years in Toto with a pair of songs from the Tambu album, beginning with the beautiful ballad “I Will Remember,” which founding guitarist Steve Lukather co-wrote with Stan Lynch of Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers. Stan told me, “Steve helped get me an office upstairs at the record company and told me to start writing words. You don’t need to be a musician when you’re around the guys in Toto. They’ve got you beat. Steve wrote the music for ‘I Will Remember’ on the piano.” You added a tribal beat to the song, unexpected for a love ballad, but it works well.
SIMON PHILLIPS: When we were writing material and recording demos for Tambu, Steve said that he had a ballad and I suggested that we try something I created that was more of a Peter Gabriel approach, which is what the song he was creating sounded like to me. I was new to the band, and it was the first album I made with them. My approach is to go song by song and not think that we are in this band, so it must sound a particular way. I’ve always ignored that. When we made the demo, Steve said, “Wow!” He was expecting it to be more like the Toto ‘80s ballad “I’ll Be Over You.” He absolutely loved this fresh approach, and it turned out to be a beautiful track.
Toto - I Will Remember (coverart)
Toto
Fabulous Flip Side: Dave’s Gone Skiing
A side: I Will Remember
CD single debut: 1995
Columbia
GM:The second song on the “I Will Remember” CD single from the album was the jazz fusion instrumental “Dave’s Gone Skiing.” When my wife Donna and I were at a Toto concert, she said that she was so impressed with the musicianship of everyone in the band, and this song, which you co-wrote, showcases the band’s versatility and even the time signature seems to jump around.
SP: That’s my fault. That’s the style of music that I am comfortable composing for years, not that Dave Paich and Steve don’t, but it is not their natural thing. I had heard their previous instrumental “Jake to the Bone” and I thought we could do something more adventurous.
On CD and digital formats from Phantom Recordings
GM: This takes us to a new instrumental, “Rising Distortion,” which is another jazz fusion recording with even a touch of the band Yes, a wonderful way to kick off the new DarWin album Distorted Mirror.
SP: That song was an afterthought. We had already recorded the album’s basic tracks. I went to Switzerland to record DarWin’s rhythm guitar parts. When we had down time, he kept playing something and wanted me to listen. I said, “But DarWin, we’ve already recorded the whole album.” He said, “I know, but take a listen to this.” I did a simple recording of it, and he liked it and wanted to develop it. I took it home, slightly rearranged it, came up with a drum track, and sent it to Mohini for her bass part, and it turned into a cool piece. I first saw Mohini play on the Cruise to the Edge and I was very impressed. I spoke with DarWin and we invited her to be part of the band. She has the most wonderful sound, and we work well together. We sent the track to Greg next, who joined us years ago to record a solo on one track, and that was the start of his involvement in DarWin as our dedicated lead guitarist. Having “Rising Distortion” on the album was a total surprise and it is a nice way to start this new record.
GM:The song that is most Toto-like is “Glow,” a beautiful ballad.
SP: Matt and I are very influenced by Toto. Ater all my years of working and producing records with them, it leads me to approach certain ballads in a unique way, and it came together nicely. On album’s ballads, I invited guitarist Andy Timmons to join us, giving the album a little more variety in sound and approach.
GM:“Loophole” is a bit ELP-like, has strong guitar, and a bounce that I enjoy.
SP: DarWin does his demo filled with a variety of ideas and he sends it to me and Matt. Matt starts thinking melodically and lyrically and I start thinking more about the arrangement and song construction. I do some serious rearranging. Once I get the core of the song, then these other ideas come up. That seems to be the style of how the three of us write. We are in three different places and then Matt comes to my Swiss studio to do the vocals, because, as a producer, I like to be hands-on with the vocals. I’m old-fashioned. I grew up where you made recordings all in the same room. There are albums made today without a producer and things are missed. It is a bit of a shame. Maybe the tempo is wrong, and I could change that, but it would mean that the artist would have to redo all the other tracks. When you were all in the room together in the old days you could say that it was a bit too fast and suggest slowing it down, or if it was in the wrong key, bringing it down a half step. These things are difficult to do these days because of the nature of the record business.
“My approach is to go song by song and not think that we are in this band, so it must sound a particular way. I’ve always ignored that. As a producer, I like to be hands-on with the vocals. I’m old-fashioned. I grew up where you made recordings all in the same room. There are albums made today without a producer and things are missed.” – Simon Phillips
GM:Speaking about tempo, “Man vs Machine” has a driving beat, reminding me of Collective Soul’s “Shine” turned up a notch, yet it is progressive and vocally melodic.
SP: The music of the band DarWin is a bit like Yes meets Dream Theater meets Crosby, Stills & Nash, because we do a lot of backing vocals and Matt’s forte is coming up with amazing harmony parts. Sometimes there are forty tracks of vocals on a song. In the mixing stage, I selectively pair it down. It has always been a vocal harmony project, which I think is interesting with the style of music we are playing.
GM:Speaking about harmonies, they nicely offset the powerful heaviness on “Cry a River.”
SP: It is mostly Matt on the harmonies, who can go up to a certain range before he must go falsetto. Then we have Jesse Siebenberg, who plays our extra instruments, and is a great singer. He used to be in Supertramp, and his father Bob was the drummer in Supertramp. Jesse grew up in a studio and started playing everything. He’s amazing and a wonderful person to have around when you are making a record. Jesse comes in and sings all the high parts. He has a lovely high voice. It is always good to have a couple of different singers. That’s another thing. Back in the day, you would send all the singers in the band into the studio with one microphone, for example 10cc, all four were great singers and you put them around a microphone and that’s one track. Then you do it again and it was the equivalent of eight tracks. It’s a lovely way of doing it. Now that we are all isolated, thanks to the demise of the traditional record business, we must do multiple layers of the same voice. Sometimes it misses the different timbres. Whenever I have the opportunity, I try to get two to three different voices.
GM:The album ends nicely with “Winter Fare,” light jazz-rock.
SP: Thank you. I take my mixes and send them to DarWin and Matt to get their feedback. Sometimes it leads to a simple change of balance or an effect. Eventually we all get happy with it. Then I send it off to the mastering engineer who takes my mixes and elevates them. It has been lovely talking with you today. Thank you. Let’s hope that a few hundred thousand more people enjoy our music as much as you do.
